User talk:Grutness

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Streetsabre (talk | contribs) at 04:17, 13 November 2006 (stub list). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

A note to all admins blocking the IP from which I (and a vandalous anon) edit: PLEASE - if you're planning on blocking 202.180.83.6 - give me a few minutes warning! That way I can close down all the work I'm in the middle of, and won't be in the situation of having templates linking to categories that haven't been created yet, or half-completed archiving! It causes havoc further down the track, and generally PISSES LOTS OF PEOPLE OFF. Grutness...wha?

Please add new discussions at the bottom of the page!

Grutness is slowly easing back on his wikiworkload - any messages posted here may not be read for some time

Earlier talk

I've moved earlier discussions to archive pages (as listed below). A few of the items I've simply got rid of - if I have, it's simply that it was trivial and/or stuff which has been dealt with, and is therefore no longer relevant. The deletion is not a reflection of my opinion of the writers!

Archive pages

Sarawak geography stubs

Thanks for fixing the piping. I will look at it so that I can get it right next time. Re:category, I thought that it would be easier to see the progess of the change from Malaysian geo stub to Sarawak geo stub, if the new category was apparent and not incipient. Is it the regular practice to create the template and not the category into which the template places the articles? Bejnar 15:46, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Requesting your opinion

I wrote the article Dr. Jose Celso Barbosa Post Office Building Designation Act, the first bill in history that contains an article from Wikipedia. It appeared on DYK and right away somebody "tags" it for deletion. I inviteyou to express yourself here:Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dr. Jose Celso Barbosa Post Office Building Designation Act. Thank you Tony the Marine 16:18, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I need your advice.

Greetings Grutness.

I don't think this is your normal area of expertise, but I'd really appreciate your take on this one. An edit war has broken out about the historical status of Denmark-Norway. I think the talk page explains it better than words. Comanche was blocked a few days ago for incivility [1] but he is back now. This time, just reverting, but I still don't like his edit summaries. His edits themselves, - well, in my book, they speak pretty much for themself. I'm at my wits end with this one and I am becoming increasingly embarassed of being Danish. Please advice what I should do now. I have no intention on violating 3RR, and as you can see, and I am pretty involved in this dispute. Regards. Valentinian (talk) 23:57, 15 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks a lot for your advice, I'll list it there. (And sorry for disturbing your wikibreak). Valentinian (talk) 07:55, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And btw, I didn't expect you to play Solomon, I'm merely trying to find some way to defuse this situation. Anyhow, I've listed the page on WP:RfC. Thanks again. Valentinian (talk) 08:07, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Current-UK-MP-stub

Hi Grutness, as the creator of {{UK-current-MP-stub}}, I have just posted a reply to the SFD for Current British MP stubs, and wondered if you would like to take a look and reconsider your vote to delete. As posted there, having populated the category, it contains over 300 articles, and there are many reasons why I think that this stub category is both viable and useful. Thanks! --BrownHairedGirl 15:09, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

New Zealander-Israeli relations

I noticed you identified yourself as a Wikipedian in New Zealand. You may be interested in New Zealander-Israeli relations. Respectfully, Republitarian 23:33, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Atlas-stub

See my reaction. Electionworld (prev. :Wilfried) (talk 07:17, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi nice stubs but you need to be more specific Rivers of French Guiana not geography. James Janderson 11:26, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

cool man. keep up the new work. I think that region of south america is very underdeveloped , Surinam as well. also check there if there is a french guiana geo stub category. James Janderson 11:36, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

hi then you are greatness rather than grutness!!! James Janderson 11:46, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Witton Lakes

In re to your Witton Lakes edit, what does "piping" mean (you used it in your edit summary)? ~ clearthought 14:01, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]


Takuu

Grutness! Hope all is going well for you after your recent bereavement. When/if you are in the mood for map creation, Takuu, a Polynesian outlier is lacking a location map. (Just draw heaps of sea and a little dot, that's about it). Cheers bro Kahuroa 05:14, 18 August 2006 (UTC) ____________________________________________________________________________[reply]

JHB again - re. article: Pyrford

Please read 'Discussion', and if you want to be involved please 'watch' the article. Wikipedia's image and reputation are at stake here - but I know you'll be up to the task. Forward as One.

--JHB 10:03, 18 August 2006 (UTC) ____________________________________________________________________________[reply]

Odd-looking edit...

You seem to have deleted a whole section of WSS/P with this edit. Editing error, or did you just not like it? :) Alai 02:52, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • And another. Having browser problems? You really ought to try Firefox sometime. :) Alai 23:30, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Auckland vs Auckland Region

Hi, I'm sorry to hear about your bereavement. I noticed you put some articles about suburbs within the Auckland urban area into Category:Auckland Region, such as Orewa and Whangaparaoa Peninsula. I'll shift them back to Category:Auckland unless I hear otherwise from you. -- Avenue 13:03, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. Until recently I haven't felt much need for admin abilities, and I'm only beginning to feel that I'd be more of a benefit than a burden to the community with them. I also have heavy work commitments for the next couple of months, so this isn't really the best time for me to learn how to use them properly. Maybe later in the year... -- Avenue 11:20, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Theta Beta Potata PUNK HOUSE Deletion Review

Theta Beta Potata

This article was first started by me and was deleted back in May '06. I was reading the punk house article and saw that the link for the TBP article was no longer red so I clicked on it and there was an article back up, started by another user. I dont know who started it because, it was deleted soon after I saw it. The decision made in the "Article for Deletion" debate should be reconsidered. The article is about a punk house not a fratenal organization. It seems that the debate, run by User:ChrisB and results were reported by User:Mailer Diablo. I will post this on their talk pages. This is the first time I have requested a deletion review so please let me know what else I need to do. If there is anything. I am on wikipedia frequently and I want to learn. Thanks. Xsxex 16:28, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Monument Park

Hi,

If you check out Talk:Monument Park, I propose that the article titled "Monument Park should be for the museum at Yankee Stadium, with the disambiguation page at Monument Park (disambiguation). Please state your case for or against my proposal on that talk page, and I will appreciate it. Thanks.

Milchama 23:59, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Otago Peninsula

Hi Rich - I notice you added an "invalid ISBN" tag to the Otago Peninsula article. Which ISBNs are the invalid ones? I have a couple of those books sitting in front of me, and the primary author of the article is User:Peter Entwisle, who is also the author of two of the listed books. Grutness...wha? 03:44, 25 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

According to my calculations User:Rich_Farmbrough\Invalid_ISBNs, The Australian National University. ISBN 0-7315-0342-1. Rgds Rich Farmbrough 07:16 25 August 2006 (GMT).

Image:WaitakiDC.jpg

Where does this picture come from? Have you recorded it? --Flominator 18:59, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My camera.Sorry - I thought I'd changed all the pd tags over to pd-self. Grutness...wha? 23:39, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Can you maybe move it to commons? --Flominator 07:29, 30 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What about the sources of Image:NZ-Oamaru.png and Image:Oamaruhistoric.jpg? Can you move these images to commons as well. If you don't want to move them by yourself, tell me and I will do it. --Flominator 12:27, 30 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Eritrea people stubs

Apparently, someone created Eritrean people stubs without any discussion that I can remember. However, they currently only have 25 and I doubt they will pass the threshold anytime soon. I don't really know the procedure for deleting/upmerging it, so I am "passing the buck" to you. Thanks.--Thomas.macmillan 13:18, 1 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Templates on the Geography Wikiproject

Thank you very much for sorting out the templates on the page, it is much appreciated.AlexD 11:00, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Tibet-geo-stub

This stub type covers Tibetan areas outside of the Tibet Autonomous Region (i.e. Tibetan autonomous prefectures and autonomous counties in nearby provinces). Is this the only geography stub type not following present-day political boundaries? Should it be rescoped (and perhaps renamed too) to cover only the Tibet Autonomous Region? — Instantnood 13:05, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I completely agree with you, and argued as such at the time it was proposed. I suggest you check the WP:WSS/P archive and contact those who created it who disagreed. Grutness...wha? 23:35, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Do you think it has to be renamed if it's rescoped? — Instantnood 14:19, 9 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Fenrus redirect...

Might something similar be done with Son of Arugal? Kukini 01:03, 9 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Organized labour stubs (part 4)

Wikipedia:Stub types for deletion/Log/2006/September/2

Well I don’t know what it is about stub names – but they seem to bring out the worst in me. :/

I’ve been thinking about my reaction, and I think it’s pretty clear that I’m having difficulty separating myself from the stubs in no small part because I started them. I seem to have vested a little pride into them. With that in mind I would like to make a small proposal.

If you would close the current debate, as Alai has suggested, I would restart it, including tagging and notifying, and use the following text:

Organized labour stubs

There have been several discussions about renaming these stubs. (original naming, rename one, rename two) They are not consistent and have generated some ongoing difficulties because of a couple conflicts: (labor vs labour) (trade union vs labour union). There are several choices to address this problem.

  1. rename to {{Africa-worker-org-stub}}. Some previous objections to this have centered around the political connotations of the word “worker”. (redirects already exist)
  2. rename to {{Africa-trade-union-stub}}. Some previous objections to this have noted that the word “union” has several uses.
  3. rename to {{Africa-labour-org-stub}}, with a spelling exception for {{US-labor-org-stub}}. This option is closest to the current names. Previous objections have noted the problem of inconsistency in spelling from country to country.

I would like to see one of these proposals adopted. As the original creator of most of these stubs I have had difficulty remaining… uh… detached from the discussion, and will recuse myself from further comment on this. Any of these choices (or others) will work just fine with me.

Does this sound OK? I don’t want to be overly dramatic about it – but it would be nice to simply solve this and then we could carry on with things. :) Cheers. Chris.--Bookandcoffee 17:01, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Restarted at Wikipedia:Stub types for deletion/Log/2006/September/11. I tagged the stubs, and notified anyone who had commented previously. I didn't tag/mention the category names - I know there are issues with those as well, but I thought one thing at a time was probably enough. Cheers.--Bookandcoffee 18:02, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

AfD Nomination: Katie Jackson

An article that you have been involved in editing, Katie Jackson, has been listed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Katie Jackson. Please look there to see why this is, if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you.

-- Malber (talk • contribs) 17:10, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

AfD Nomination: Billy Jackson

An article that you have been involved in editing, Billy Jackson, has been listed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Billy Jackson. Please look there to see why this is, if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you.

-- Malber (talk • contribs) 17:22, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Image:NZ-L Tekapo.png

Hi Grutness, I'm really sorry to bother you again, but I have to :) Is this also PD-self? --Flominator 06:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Sigh - yes. Another one I mislabelled! All the maps which I have uploaded (about 250 of them, for New Zealand and Bermuda) should be marked PD-self. If you notice any that aren't, please feel free to change the template over. Grutness...wha?

My RFA

Thank you, Grutness, for voting on my RFA, which passed 95 to 1. Now that I have the mop, I hope I can live up to the standard, and be a good administrator. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me. —this is messedrocker (talk) 21:42, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Animal rights stub

I did propose it, people agreed, and I waited over seven days (actually around three weeks, I believe) before creating it, so the process was followed. SlimVirgin (talk) 23:45, 15 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

WP:WSS/P#Animal_rights. SlimVirgin (talk) 23:47, 15 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
No worries. :-) SlimVirgin (talk) 23:56, 15 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Stubs

Hey I just noticed you deleted the SE Asia stub for the Ban Houayxay article. I was just wondering if stubs are only supposed to have one stub category? Ive been adding 2 or sometimes even 3 stub categories to stub articles, thinking that was ok. If its preferable to only have one, I can go back and change what I have done. Just curious --Gregorof 03:27, 17 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

(as on my talk page) Ok, thanks then. Is there anything I can help you with project-wise? Im still a new editor, and am finishing up my wikipedia to-do list, and looking for things to do. Dont mind doing the nitty-gritty stuff, ie stub organizing ( I am definately a WikiGnome ) ... please let me know. --Gregorof 07:12, 17 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

NSW, UK

Did you just find out that New South Wales is in Britain? Gosh! Most of us have known for a while... :) - CrazyRussian talk/email 10:26, 18 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The Lost EP

Noted but I only changed it once not multiple times (like your message made it sound). I wouldn't know whether it was called The Lost or The Lost EP since I'm not really a fan of the Chills, just used my flatmates CD's to get the discog off them. I wouldn't have reversed it either since I'm concentrating on the other NZ bands now. I've done what I could with The Chills. Sweet Originalsinner 23:12, 18 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

ACTUALLY... I may have done it twice, once yesterday when I added it and the first time when I changed the format of the discography. I have to say with the pix and the reformat their discog is looking mighty nice. :) (*me being humble... not :-p). Originalsinner 00:01, 19 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maraba Coffee

Hello! As you're a Wikipedian interested in African topics, I'm writing to notify you that the Maraba Coffee article is now a 'Featured Article Candidate'. Please feel free to evaluate the article and write your support or opposition at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates. Thanks — SteveRwanda 15:01, 19 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Stubs

Hi, sorry, I thought that the debate was not required for redirects, furthermore, I didn't know that redirecting British to England would be offensive to Scots, Wales, etc. I thought that they're all part of Great Britain and thus, British. I'll stop doing that. Thanks for the info. ''F3-R4'' 02:03, 22 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

''F3-R4'' has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Smile to others by adding {{subst:smile}}, {{subst:smile2}} or {{subst:smile3}} to their talk page with a friendly message. Happy editing!

Ok, thanks for the explanation about England and British. I've always thought England is British and Scotland etc was part of it. :D Also 'bout the stubs and everything. Thanks again :) ''F3-R4'' 06:33, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hong Kong stubs

I believe you'd be the most suitable person to say something at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Stub sorting, regarding the hierarchy structure of these stub types. :-D — Instantnood 17:28, 24 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hull Lit & Phil article

Hi Grutness. (I too was born in Barnet - lived near Ravenscrpft park!!)
I came back to re-edit the narticle today and it seems to have disappeared! - where has it gone to?
(I don't thnk it offended the copyright esp. as I have been in touch with the copyright holder. But anyhow i am happy to edit it so ti is OK if it can be reinstalled!
Johnbibby 17:39, 24 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Dunedin Double EP

No prob. It will be "non-standard," like Magical Mystery Tour.Fantailfan 22:31, 25 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Found OUSA at typo

Otago Univesity Students' Association. Heh. --Limegreen 10:56, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

PS - Having found OUSA, I was wondering if a merge of the OUSA Clubs and Societies Centre would be sensible. I'm usually not much one for deleting or merging, but that seems a bit of a stretch...--Limegreen 11:13, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

DRV

Category:Animal liberation movement on deletion review

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Category:Animal liberation movement. Since you closed the deletion discussion for (or speedy-deleted) this article, your reasons on how or why you did so will be greatly appreciated in the above review. SlimVirgin (talk) 15:45, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I did neither of these things. I advise you to find the administrator who did and check your facts before making any more of these accusations - I'm getting thoroughly sick of it. Grutness...wha? 23:21, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
What accusations? As you should know, the above is just a template; I was simply letting you know about the DRV as a matter of courtesy. Your attitude in all this has been a mystery to me, I have to say. SlimVirgin (talk) 23:22, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, this has gone far enough. Stop your threats and your attitude. You got involved in something you have no knowledge of; insisted on pursuing a pointless process; undid a lot of my work; caused a lot of pointless discussion; and now when I tell you about the DRV as a matter of courtesy, I get told off again. If you think you have grounds for an RfAr, be my guest. SlimVirgin (talk) 23:29, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above may be a template, but it's one that is highly inappropriate for use if the person whose talk page it is placed on has not "closed the deletion discussion for (or speedy-deleted) this article". You have previously accused me of proposing a stub type for deletion, which I have not done, and of telling you to create a new category, which I have not done. And blanking your talk page doesn't hide that fact. Grutness...wha? 23:45, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Fastest redirect in the West.

Got an itchy trigger finger and I ain't afraid ta use it, pardner.  :) - Lucky 6.9 01:25, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Tis ok i don't mind

LONG LIVE WIKIPEDIA! Sam 1123 15:05, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

UTexas-stub

Hey, just doing some regular sorting/editing and came across the University of Texas at Austin stubs (UTexas-stub). I thought this seemed very strange and took a look at its history. I saw you SFD'd it back in March, but then withdrew it. Why was that? It seems far too broad to have its own stub (can anyone related to UTA use it? or perhaps just faculty? or buildings?) Did it go through the normal stub process?--Thomas.macmillan 20:52, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]


list of letters that don't start with themselves phonetically

This is regarding your comment on the discussion page of the article above. The IPA says that it isnt pronounced "feff" plus this is an article about phonetics, it doesn't matter whether or not its silent, because phonetically it doesn't start with an f. --User:REDMON89

If you read my comment again, I hope it will become clear that was a humorous suggestion (I could just have easily said that "W" was spelt "wdoubleyou" with a silent "W". The point I was making is that there are no accepted standard spellings for the names of letters, and as such the article is pointless. Grutness...wha? 06:39, 2 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hello there :-)

I just want to point out that there is a link at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anse_Lazio which is not relevant for the given item and the targeted website is just for commercial ad-use. The link is called "Pictures and journey report"

Since I have no idea about Wikipedia and editing, I ask you to remove this. I am sorry if it creates extra work.

Best Regards,

Gunter

Dunedin Double EP

Double EP is currently not a type supported by WP:ALBUM, thence it's put in the category: Non-standard album infoboxes and gets a peachpuff colour. Since the title already includes the "double ep" qualification, either EP Album or Box seems the most appropriate of the supported types.Spearhead 16:02, 4 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Link Colors

I'm not sure why but since I started using my laptop in a new location I've been having a lot of trouble telling blue links from purple links in the default skin. Honestly, I hate all the other skins, so changing isn't an option. Is there anything I can do to make the links change to the colors I specify in my browser so I can tell the difference between where I've clicked and where I've not? Aelfthrytha 15:15, 9 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Links Answer - If you're curious

   For each user skin there is a CSS file you can edit. If you edit the CSS file you can change the default color. For example, to go your monobook(the default skin) CSS file enter User:Aelfthrytha/monobook.css, edit the page with this:

A:link {color:green;} A:visited {color:orange;} 

   This will change the new and visited links to green and orange, respectively. You can either write the name of the color, or use a hex triplet (e.g. #ff0000 = Red) if you want to try a wide variety of palettes. From Mitaphane

Aelfthrytha 03:39, 10 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Te Rangi Hiroa (Peter Buck)

added a couple of pics to this article which you started. It has been flagged as lacking footnotes tho in your original version the source is clearly the NZDB. Kahuroa 10:33, 11 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Had another tutu, got the proper citation form from the NZDB article and added it as a reference, took off the citation tag, so it should be ok now I think. Your headings are great. Kahuroa 05:04, 12 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

RfB With A Smile :)

      

Caribbean stubs

Remember me from this discussion on WP:WSS back in late July? Well, my idea for Caribbean country stubs didn't work the way I wanted it, and at last I've come to visit you for a new proposal.

As Guettarda (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) suggested on my talk page at the time of the original proposal, this site needs stub categories for the Lesser and Greater Antilles, along with the Windwards and Leewards if need be. Here are the new suggestions:

It might be a better idea to put articles into those stub categories, rather than wasting time and underpopulating those for individual countries. We might have more pages in them that way.

I hope you appreciate the re-working, and if you do, we'll take the issue back to WSS. Thank you. --Slgr@ndson (page - messages - contribs) 22:43, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actors who portrayed... catagories

Why can't you understand that I created those Actors/Actresses who portrayed... subcatagories because the Batman actors and Superman actors catagories were getting severely large. So breaking them down became much more conveinent for the user. Besides, there's only an elite number of actors who have portrayed a particular iconic comic book character like Batman and Superman (so they should get extra focus). TMC1982 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, perhaps if I had been told that was the reason, I could have understood it. To say I "can't understand" it implies that that possibility had been suggested to me. Now, a counter-question - why can't you understand what is better to have as a list and what is better to have as a category? There is no need for a supercategory for either Superman actors or Batman actors - it is far better to present that information in list form so that more information can be readily available, and so that individual actor articles aren't swamped with potentially dozens of categories relating to individual roles. I suggest you examint the Wikipedia guidelines as to what information is best presented in category form and what is better presnted in list form. Information like what actors have portrayed a particular role is far better suited to list form, since it can be arranged chronologically, or by medium, or by type of portrayal, with extra information about whether the performance has been a one-off or on several occasions, in the UK, US or elsewhere, etc etc etc. with a category you simply get an alphabetical list, which is perhaps better than no information at all, but barely so. This is one situation where lists are far, far more useful than categories. Grutness...wha? 03:18, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Where exactly are we going to put and/or find "these lists?" We could go to the articles relating to the comic book character or whomever in the "In other media..." section, but that's much more broad, since it doesn't simply considered who played what. You also have to take under consideration the merchandising standpoint besides to television and film (both live-action and animation) standpoint. Personally, it's faster and more concise to simply look at a catagory of Actors who portrayed Batman (e.g. Adam West, Kevin Conroy, etc.) or James Bond or whomever then to go scroll down a lenghty article about the character(s) themselves. And another thing, I don't think that simply having a list is as easy as it sounds because you also have to go into some detail about when they portrayed the said character and how they portrayed it.TMC1982 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Where do you think you'd put them? In one specific category Category:Actors and actresses who have portrayed specific characters, and linked from articles on the particular characters - as is done in other similar situations with other articles throughout Wikipedia. That's the way these things work best. Many many times better than they could ever be done by individual categorisations. Grutness...wha? 03:58, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If a list was ready made in a see also link, then personally, you would have to enter an actor's name in the search engine one-by-one. And if anything, if you clicked on the Actors who portrayed... catagory, there would be a ready made catalog of other actors who have potrayed the same role. That would be a lot more "to the point" than in my imagination, going by rote memory about who played what.TMC1982 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Those arguments make it clear you don't fully understand the difference between a category and a list, since they support a list over a category - they are exactly the reason why a list makes more sense than a category. If a list was linked from "see also", then that list would be stand-alone and would have all the information you could have about a specific performance - information which would not be possible from a category. There would be no need with a list to enter any names whatsoever into a search engine. It would also provide a ready-made catalogue of actors who have portrayed a role, all arranged in a form that would make it very easy to find any information you might need with at most one extra click, unlike a category. With a category, you would need to use rote memory to find out who played that when - that wouldn't be needed with a list.
Consider this: Actors who have played Doctor Who.
In a category, you'd see this:
In a list, you could see this:
Canonical:
  • William Hartnell: (November 23, 1963–October 29, 1966) - BBC TV series
  • Patrick Troughton: (November 5, 1966–June 21, 1969) - BBC TV series
  • Jon Pertwee: (January 3, 1970–June 8, 1974) - BBC TV series
  • Tom Baker: (June 8, 1974–March 21, 1981) - BBC TV series
  • Peter Davison: (March 21, 1981–March 16, 1984) - BBC TV series
  • Colin Baker: (March 16, 1984–December 6, 1986) - BBC TV series
  • Sylvester McCoy: (September 7, 1987–December 6, 1989) - BBC TV series, and May 27, 1996, in the Doctor Who television film)
  • Paul McGann: (May 27, 1996) in the Doctor Who television film.
  • Christopher Eccleston: (March 26–June 18, 2005) - BBC TV series
  • David Tennant: (June 18, 2005–present) - BBC TV series
Non-canonical:
Now, tell me - which provides the more information in ready-to study form? Could you tell from the category alone who portrayed the Doctor in films, or who portrayed the Doctor in 1967?

Grutness...wha? 04:45, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Really, my point-of-view is an interesting tidbit/individual acheivement about the actors/actresses themselves (based on the individual articles) rather than purely the fictional character. It's not any different than say, people who have hosted the Academy Awards or people, who won a Nobel Prize, and who were voted the most valuble player of the Super Bowl. Why does it have to be strictly just one end of the spectrum. If people want a list, then go to the list. But don't erase the "invividual achievement" (i.e. in the catagories section) that's listed in each article.TMC1982 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, this really doesn't follow from what you've been talking about before. Items like People who have hosted the Academy Awards are better served as a list, too. The individual achievement, if its worth anything, will be in the article anyway, so it isn't necessary to clutter up the end of the article by repeating it, and it certainly isn't necessary to create what could only ever be a sub-standard duplicate of a list in category form. Have you read that Wikipedia page I pointed you to earlier? Ah, skip that - if you had read it, you wouldn't still be arguing that a category is a good idea. Grutness...wha? 05:28, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to do things strictly by listifying, then what limits are their going to be? Personally, we might as well not catagorize here on Wikipedia to begin with. For example, we might as well just list people who are from Los Angeles rather than catagorize them.TMC1982 16 October 2006 (UTC)

I can't answer that, because I don't want to replace all categories entirely by lists. If you had read that link I pointed out, you'd see that it clearly gives indications of circumstances in which categories are better than lists, and also when lists are better than categories. The actors categories are clearly better as lists by those guidelines. Grutness...wha? 22:17, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

BOT - Regarding your recent protection of Template:Palestine-geo-stub:

You recently protected[2] this page but did not give a protection summary. If this is an actual (not deleted) article, talk, or project page, make sure that it is listed on WP:PP. VoABot will automatically list such protected pages only if there is a summary. Do not remove this notice until a day or so, otherwise it may get reposted. Thanks. VoABot 05:01, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Dance stubs

Hey Grutness, thanks for commenting on the dance stubs and for the information in your comment. I'm pretty new (actually, brand spankin' new) to creating new stubs and wanted to ask: How does it actually work? Do we decide on the stub categories and then I go off and create them? Or does somebody else do that?--Will.i.am 21:38, 17 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Re: Sarah Garnett

Well, it's SOMETHING, but pretty general. Verifiability is a necessary but not sufficient criteria. Check my additional comments at the AFD discussion. --Jayron32 03:45, 18 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Shpend Xani Actor

A certain new user has created an article about an article that should be speedily deleted, Shpend Xani Actor. However, when I tag it (and someone else did too), the user deletes the tag.--Thomas.macmillan 21:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like it's been dealt with before I got online today :) Grutness...wha?

The {{Stub}} tag

Is the stub tag deprecated? WP:WSS says so but Category:Stubs does not. If it is can you please read the bottom of my talk page and User:Elonka's talk page and respond. Thank you --- Skapur 04:45, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

replied (in summary, yes and no - it is deprecated, but can still be used) Grutness...wha?
Thanks for the explanation. In those cases when I'm using something like WP:AWB and I'm rapidly going through hundreds of articles, is there a template that I can use to say, "I can tell that this article needs to be stubbed, but I don't have time to classify it right now"? Or would it be better to just put a "Cleanup|<date>" tag on it and move on, rather than trying to stub it? --Elonka 07:21, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Yup, that's pretty much what I've been doing, geo-stub, bio-stub, artist-stub, etc. But if I can't figure it out in about 10 seconds, I just {{stub}} it and move on. :) If a different system does become preferred though, please let me know! --Elonka 07:29, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Your name being taken in vain...

Well, not quite, but Ancient Stub History is being thrown up at Category talk:Hong Kong sportspeople stubs, and you might be in a better position to comment on it than I am, as you seem to have been involved in the original decision. (Not that I'm calling you an Ancient Stubber, or anything.) BTW, you might want to look at closing out {{SouthAm-geo-stub}} and {{CentralAm-geo-stub}}, since I seem to be in the minority, no-one else is rushing to do it (to put it mildly), it's not entirely clear whether you wished to implement the compromise you floated at one point, so it would look (and possibly be) a bit fishy if I were to close it on the basis that was your final view. Alai 05:16, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

template redirects

I understand transclusion can be expensive, but I still don't understand how using a redirect to a template is any more expensive. Is this something along the lines of "don't use double redirects"? Could you point me to a discussion of the technical side of this? Thanks. Lunch 23:24, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. The "authoritative" discussion seems to be at User_talk:Jamesday#Template_redirects. If all templates were redirects, it would double the amount of work the server would be doing when loading a page with those templates. It seems it currently affects about 1% of server load whose elimination (as small as it sounds) would be a significant relief. Cheers, Lunch 01:56, 22 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Could you relook at Walk point?

I have no axe to grind here, but I think there's a nugget worth saving, so I rewrote it, and assigned to to MilHist project. IMHO, it would be a waste to delete it; there's more than a definition now. If it's worked into a tactics article, it can later be merged or expanded, as appropriate. BusterD 01:58, 24 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Vandal

Anytime my friend :) Btw, I hadn't noticed you were online so I made a little note at WP:VIP. Kids these days ... Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 21:55, 24 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Re: Saving Walk/Take Point

Sounds like a Tom Hanks movie doesn't it? Thanks for your support. Is that normal, that someone in the AfD discussion suddenly loves an article and keeps it from dying the death of many deletes? This was my first day participating at Afd, I'm learning about adminship and have superior coaches, but there's so much to know before one can truly be bold. I keep comparing this wiki-experience to "drinking from the firehose". In Walk point I saw something that should be here: a military science task force or portal. I've been feeling this out with other editors for a while, so the article discussion was no revelation, but more a catalyst. BusterD 22:45, 24 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Thanks for fixing that. I should get some sleep! Brian | (Talk) 10:02, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

your change to Collin County Parks and open spaces

Parks and open spaces of Collin County, Texas -

The actual office of park and open space management is called "Collin County Parks and Open Spaces". The page was not about just any 'open space' in collin county but about the five parks maintained or owned by this county office. I think the page should be returned to it's original title and I'll make it clear in the article that this is an official title and not a general 'parks and spaces' collection. Thanks. Transderm 12:40, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sfd coding

Aha! I made an edit which did create that page, but then went back to sfd and didn't see it...now I know why. D'oh. Thanks - Pegship 22:34, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Template:WSS

Hi Grutness

Will it be disrupting process to remove the duplicate list from this template? What bothers me by having it there is that it including it makes it look like WP:WSS has approved this thing. Please advice. Regards. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 22:35, 28 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think there's much problem removing the template from the page - you're right, it does imply that WSS had something to do with the page. Grutness...wha? 23:07, 28 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but I think we got our wires crossed. I wish to removed it from the "official" WP:WS template listing the project's subpages (in other words: to undo this edit: [3].) I'm not suggesting editing the fork page as such. Regards. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 23:18, 28 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Oh! I didn't realise it was even on that - no I don't see any problem with removing it from there, either - that definitely suggests that it's an official WSS page. Grutness...wha? 23:24, 28 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Vulcans are People Too

"weak keep, even though the name makes it sound like a Vulcan". Grutness...wha? 23:48, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Since you're in New Zealand, you may be interested in knowing that Telecom (TNZ) is one of our largest customers. If you call their toll free number, you'll be talking with TuVox, your favorite vulcan. Anyway, thanks for the vote. Nezzo 00:07, 29 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]


Pakistan medals

I have the pics of all the Pakistani military medals.I need you help to upload them on wikipedia.plz help me. User:Sulaimandaud

Julia Sinédia-Cazour

Hello there,

I want to ask you something:Is age in itself a quality that makes someone notable enough for Wikipedia. see Julia Sinédia-Cazour. I have tried to prod the entry for deletion but it was twice deleted. What are your thoughts?--Thomas.macmillan 16:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Thanks for the advice. After reading the deletion policy, i also agree that he was right. How does one submit it to AfD? --Thomas.macmillan 05:28, 30 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My username

Sharp eye. It's homage alone. At home, I have a whole wall devoted to photographs of Cliff Bastin. And, no, you haven't asked me before. Or you have, and I forgot.

I also see that, not only were you born in Barnet, you were born in Barnet when it was part of our great county, which makes you an official Hertfordshirian! By comparison, I was born in Chelsea, so I'm just an expat. Where my New Zealand credentials are, I'll never know, but I do own a pretty little booklet that entitles me to call myself a Kiwi. Bastin 10:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Re:Pakistan medals

the copyright tags and other such things User:Sulaimandaud

Edit to Abyss Pool

Please note that your recent edit to Abyss Pool was reverted for inaccurate information. The Abyss Pool is located in Wyoming, not California.

Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Stub types index

Hi Grutness. I'm still not sure I like the idea about multiple stub lists but have you seen the new version? Regards. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 13:12, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I felt you deserved it...

The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
For your continued service to Wikipedia. This community needs more people who are just as dedicated as you are to this project. We salute you! Sharkface217 21:32, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]


You're quite welcome. Sharkface217 22:47, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Who's this, then?

Your article is much better than mine. - Scooter 05:43, 4 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm still at the embarrassment stage about it - there are far more worthy people that don't have articles yet, but apparently I was a redlink on several pages, so someone decided I needed an article. They seem to have used the "non-article" I wrote as a user subpage as a basis for it. I wondered if it was the same Steve Kramer... shouldn't you have {{Notable Wikipedian}} on the talk page of the article :)? Grutness...wha? 07:02, 4 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hans,Hant

RFA thanks from Mike

Thank you for your Support on my recent RfA, which I withdrew at 16/20/4. The criticism I received will hopefully result in me learning becoming a better editor, and thanks again for your support!

— Michael Billington (talk • contribs) 23:14, 4 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

MfD on Admin Standards pages

Please see this deletion debate. Carcharoth 00:51, 5 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Sailor

Well that's one way to introduce myself :-p

Hi by the way.

I'm just leaving a message because I don't agree with the comment/"clean-up" thing left on the Hello Sailor's page/talk page above the discography and was wondering what your opinion on it is.

Cheers

RIANZ 03:26, 6 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oh and yes I'm a Kiwi.

Hey again I'm working at RIANZ for like two months and do this when I'm bored. I have another prob. The JPS Experience single, Ray Of Shine has a music notability. I think the admin person has a hardon for that since he/she/it did the same thing for a Goodnight Nurse single. So what shall we do? Oh and I'll be adding the Warratahs albums (not all but some) over the next few days.

Cheers

RIANZ 02:15, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually it's all recently added singles (and EPs?). I don't have time to cite a CD back. Really NZ music should just be left to the Kiwi's.
OK it's now the following. Only a little bit. Ray Of Shine‎ by JPS Experience, Go (Steriogram song), Soccerstar‎ & White Trash (song)

by Steriogram, My Only‎ and Death Goes to Disco‎ by Goodnight Nurse. They all have music importance template added to them. I was going to yell at him but since I (after much research... and boredom...) see that you contribute to a lot of NZ music, thought I'd seek you're help again. Sorry to be a pain. Oh and it's some user called User: Palfrey RIANZ 02:46, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Paul Fairclough's birthday

Hi Grutness. This is kind of a long shot, but I was wondering if you were a Barnet fan. If so, do you know what Paul Fairclough's birthday is? I recently created List of English Football League managers by date of appointment and I can't find a source for Fairclough's birthday anywhere. HornetMike 17:19, 7 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thomas Burns (New Zealand)

No problem - it was just a way of disambiguating him... I don't profess to have any knowledge on him, hence why I didn't create a stub article. robwingfield (talk) 14:21, 9 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Grutness, just wanted to say thanks for starting the Thomas Burns article. Certainly notable and nice not to have that red link throughout Otago related articles. Blarneytherinosaur talk 03:11, 10 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi I am currently going through European film most notably Finland and Belgium. I strongly suggest that a new stub category Finland-actor-stub is set up because soon the Euro-actor-stub cat will be WAY!!! to big. Also this will ease the use of the Finland-bio-stub which will soon be getting to large. Ernst Stavro Blofeld 10:33, 10 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sinai vs Arabia

What's the difference between the Sinai Peninsula and Arabia?

The satellite views seem to show the same region, yet neither article mentions the other.

Roger Derby

Hi Roger - not quite sure why you've asked me this, but still - I've loaded up a small gif to show the difference. The large green area on this map is the Arabian Peninsula - it includes the country of Saudi Arabia and several other smaller coutries like Yemen, Kuwait and Qatar. The orange area is the much smaller Sinai Peninsula which is now part of Egypt but was occupied by Israel during the 1970s. Grutness...wha? 22:19, 10 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

stub list

I wasn't aware they were done automaticly now. I just figured since nothing was done for a while, someone had to do it. I'm sorry if I messed anything up, but thanks for letting me know (so I don't waste any time with it). Streetsabre 04:17, 13 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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