Commons:Deletion requests/Deutsche Wochenschau films

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Deutsche Wochenschau films[edit]

There's no evidence that archive.org holds the copyright to these film clips (which I'm sure they don't), or that they've licensed them under the CC license. These clips are almost certainly still copyrighted in Germany, and thus fail the criterion that files be out of copyright in both the US and the country of origin. Unless they have some status as seized Nazi war material (which has not been asserted or proved), then they are also still copyrighted in the US and cannot be moved to en.wikipedia either. Parsecboy (talk) 12:29, 3 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed, it seems I was misled by some statement in http://www.archive.org/ and the newsreels are not licensed as I wrongly stated. I have been doing some research and it seems Transit-Film GmbH is handling the commercial exploitation of these (see [1]). However, this company is owned by the Federal Republic of German (sole shareholder is the Federal Republic of Germany, represented by delegates of the Federal Ministry of Culture and the Media (BKM). [2]. I have just contacted them to see if these clips could be kept under a free-enough license similar to the Bundesarchiv pictures already granted for use in Commons as they seem to come from the Bundesarchiv itself! Taking into account the effort I made in searching into the films and producing the clips, I'd say it is worth waiting for the answer before deleting them if the community agrees. If any user has previous experience in negotiating this kind of concessions I think it would be great if he/she could lend a hand to keep these very interesting historical newreels in Commons.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 19:34, 3 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Latest update for the time being. The answer from Transit-Film GmbH is negative but they state the copyright for these newsreels belongs to the Bundesarchiv:

Thank you for your message. The rights for the archive "Deutsche Wochenschau" are with the Bundesarchiv, Filmarchiv which is a government owned institution. This archive material is also being stored there. Our company, Transit Film GmbH, a German crowned company, is the distribution company for this archive stock. The rights are indeed not in the public domaine but belongs the Bundesarchiv, Filmarchiv. A use of this archive material through Wikipedia is not allowed.

This is my plan to try to keep this very relevant content in Commons:

1.-I am trying to contact one of the users that was involved in the agreement with Bundesarchiv for their pictures.

2.-If he is unable to assist in trying to get permission to use this short clips from the newsreels I will try the administrators.

3.-If there is no luck there either I will try to contact Bundesarchiv myself (though I think options 1 and 2 have a better chance of succeeding).

If none of the above actions turn out well I suppose there will be no choice but to throw all this work out of the window and remove the videos. And seriously reconsider staying in Commons as far as I am concerned...--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 07:43, 5 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Good luck, but based on the response of Transit-Film GmbH, I'm not optimistic. Parsecboy (talk) 21:57, 6 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

A request has been made to Bundesarchiv's Filmarchiv to ask for permission to use of these newsreels under a CC license similar to Bundesaarchiv's pictures. Awaiting an answer.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 21:05, 20 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'll leave this open for now, to give some more time to get an answer. Jcb (talk) 20:40, 10 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I wrote some time ago to Filmsarchiv's mail but got no answer (either positive of negative) yet. If I get none by Monday, I'll try with Bundesarchiv itself, at least to get some response either way...--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 12:30, 11 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I just wrote to Bundesarchiv itself to see if I can get an answer on the use of these videos. I'll write again if and when I get an answer...--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 18:05, 16 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

For these cases I believe it applies {{PD-Germany}}Quahadi Añtó 08:53, 18 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

{{PD-Germany}} redirects to {{PD-old-70}}, which requires the author to have died 70 years ago. That means the authors of these films need to have died in 1941, which is quite impossible.

These films are unquestionably still copyrighted in Germany; the only question is whether the Bundesarchiv will allow us to use them as they have with the image donation they made a couple years ago. Parsecboy (talk) 15:10, 18 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The answer I got so far is: It is at time not possible to grant CC licenses for moving images as the Federal Archives did for stills, as the administration of our rights to these holdings is contracted to a commercial company and the use of some parts of the newsreels is restricted to specified projects to prevent the arbitrary spreading of national socialist propaganda. Your request however is the first one ever and a good starting point to discuss at least a specified licence free, if not a general CC usage for Wikipedia articles with this company. Which footage exactly would you personally be interested in? - You may or may not know, that shotlists of any German newsreel released between 1939 and 1945 (and some thousand documentaries of our holdings more) are published at http://www.filmarchives-online.eu/ Some newsreels are even provided as streaming media at www.wochenschau-archiv.de. Any further usage, including the one at archive.org has to considered as piracy from the German copyright perspective.

I am trying to get permission to keep the clips already in place in Commons under an acceptable license (acceptable both for Bundesarchiv and Commons, that is) and, if at all possible, obtain permission to use other short clips that editors may find historically relevant. I hope that a control of the granted material by Bundesarchiv will be enough to get such permission... As usual, I will keep the page updated with the latest information.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 13:51, 22 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Deleted: for now, files can be restored after permission receipt Jcb (talk) 08:02, 10 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Commons:Deletion requests/Deutsche Wochenschau films

Deutsche Wochenschau films[edit]

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